Comments on: Chattin’ it up http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/ Baseball's Future in the Gateway City Wed, 11 Mar 2009 20:21:52 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=MU hourly 1 By: azruavatar http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7651 azruavatar Fri, 28 Sep 2007 17:19:41 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7651 Paul - there's a legitimate discussion to be had here about whether the Mulder-Haren trade is symptomatic of the organizations a) internal hierarchy and b) their ability to evaluate emerging pitching. Haren was a huge miss for the organization and while I can't come down on them personally (I understood, if not liked, the trade at the time) it's a valid topic. Paul - there’s a legitimate discussion to be had here about whether the Mulder-Haren trade is symptomatic of the organizations a) internal hierarchy and b) their ability to evaluate emerging pitching. Haren was a huge miss for the organization and while I can’t come down on them personally (I understood, if not liked, the trade at the time) it’s a valid topic.

]]> By: Paul http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7648 Paul Fri, 28 Sep 2007 15:19:06 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7648 Enough about Haren/Mulder! What's done is done! Enough about Haren/Mulder! What’s done is done!

]]> By: Lou Schuler http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7647 Lou Schuler Fri, 28 Sep 2007 14:59:28 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7647 C70, do we know that's how it happened? I know Duncan said that this summer, but I'd never before read that Duncan saw that kind of potential in Haren. Honestly, I read that quote with some cynicism. I figured Duncan was retrospectively shifting his opinion of Haren to match Haren's post-trade performance. If what Duncan said is true, and he really thought Haren had top-of-the-rotation potential at the time of the trade, then I wonder how often this happens. I mean, was he really enthusiastic about Kip Wells, or did he just say he was to cover for his bosses? C70, do we know that’s how it happened? I know Duncan said that this summer, but I’d never before read that Duncan saw that kind of potential in Haren.

Honestly, I read that quote with some cynicism. I figured Duncan was retrospectively shifting his opinion of Haren to match Haren’s post-trade performance.

If what Duncan said is true, and he really thought Haren had top-of-the-rotation potential at the time of the trade, then I wonder how often this happens. I mean, was he really enthusiastic about Kip Wells, or did he just say he was to cover for his bosses?

]]> By: cardinal70 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7645 cardinal70 Fri, 28 Sep 2007 14:07:42 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7645 I still find it fascinating that Duncan wanted to keep Haren and TLR didn't. If you were ever going to listen to your pitching coach, that would have been a good time. I still find it fascinating that Duncan wanted to keep Haren and TLR didn’t. If you were ever going to listen to your pitching coach, that would have been a good time.

]]> By: BigJawnMize http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7643 BigJawnMize Fri, 28 Sep 2007 13:26:06 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7643 Erik- Give me a couple weeks. I am not sure who saw the proposals I did for VEB. A couple of them had some support, but it is difficult there because the site name refers to a charater. Erik-

Give me a couple weeks. I am not sure who saw the proposals I did for VEB. A couple of them had some support, but it is difficult there because the site name refers to a charater.

]]> By: Erik http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7612 Erik Thu, 27 Sep 2007 20:46:17 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7612 BJM...i would like to see that t-shirt design. BJM…i would like to see that t-shirt design.

]]> By: BigJawnMize http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7610 BigJawnMize Thu, 27 Sep 2007 20:34:09 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7610 Oh by the way, not that I think it will sell much but I was going draw a future rebirds logo/tshirt. I was thinking along the lines of a bird with a Dolorian. Oh by the way, not that I think it will sell much but I was going draw a future rebirds logo/tshirt. I was thinking along the lines of a bird with a Dolorian.

]]> By: BigJawnMize http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7609 BigJawnMize Thu, 27 Sep 2007 20:31:03 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7609 Amen Lou! Keep rockin' it for the Lord! Amen Lou! Keep rockin’ it for the Lord!

]]> By: Lou Schuler http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7608 Lou Schuler Thu, 27 Sep 2007 20:11:47 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7608 I'm shooting lower than any of you guys: I just want to see a pitcher developed within our organization whose strengths and potential are understood and exploited by management. The last guy who met that description was probably Matt Morris. I hope Wainwright is the next, with the obvious caveat that he was drafted and partially developed by Atlanta. I don't want to come off like some crank who's still bitching about the Steve Carlton trade (although it did suck), but I have to think that there was a serious misjudgment of Danny Haren. No matter how much they liked Mulder, the only way they made that trade is if they thought Haren would never be more than a middle-of-the-rotation innings-eater. I could understand Barton and Calero for Mulder, since Barton's skill set would work better in the Oakland system than in ours. But you don't give up those two guys plus a major-league starter if you have any inkling that the starter has top-of-the-rotation potential. So it doesn't matter much to me if Mortensen masters a changeup or Ottavino gets the hang of the two-seam fastball. Right now, I just don't have much confidence in the way our management assesses pitching potential. I’m shooting lower than any of you guys: I just want to see a pitcher developed within our organization whose strengths and potential are understood and exploited by management.

The last guy who met that description was probably Matt Morris. I hope Wainwright is the next, with the obvious caveat that he was drafted and partially developed by Atlanta.

I don’t want to come off like some crank who’s still bitching about the Steve Carlton trade (although it did suck), but I have to think that there was a serious misjudgment of Danny Haren. No matter how much they liked Mulder, the only way they made that trade is if they thought Haren would never be more than a middle-of-the-rotation innings-eater.

I could understand Barton and Calero for Mulder, since Barton’s skill set would work better in the Oakland system than in ours. But you don’t give up those two guys plus a major-league starter if you have any inkling that the starter has top-of-the-rotation potential.

So it doesn’t matter much to me if Mortensen masters a changeup or Ottavino gets the hang of the two-seam fastball. Right now, I just don’t have much confidence in the way our management assesses pitching potential.

]]> By: Grant http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7607 Grant Thu, 27 Sep 2007 19:54:54 +0000 http://futureredbirds.com/2007/09/26/chattin-it-up/#comment-7607 Personally, I'd much rather see Mortensen improve the sinker-slider combo as much as possible rather than spend time working on a change. Personally, I’d much rather see Mortensen improve the sinker-slider combo as much as possible rather than spend time working on a change.

]]>