I was perusing the inter-web today and the hot-button issue is again the Mark Buerhle on again off again spectacle. Reportedly, Kenny Williams was asking for the other GMs first born child for the better part of last week before extension negotiations picked up over the weekend. Apparently those have been shelved because Buerhle wants a no-trade clause.
Since Larry’s gone from VeB, some major trade is bound to go down (or at least that’s the fashionable inside joke that we like to throw around over there). If Williams was asking for Rasmus and Garcia, I’d tell him to take a hike. But now that extension talks seem at a standstill, I’d give him a ring again.
There’s one way to build a package for Buerhle, imo. It starts with Anthony Reyes. I’m decidedly on the Reyes apologists’ bandwagon and without a trace of guilt about that. The question is whether Williams is. Reyes can step directly into Buerhle’s place in the rotation and while it’s an undoubted downgrade, it’s a minimum salary major league starter. But what would the accompanying prospect package look like?
The troika of Rasmus, Anderson and Garcia should be off-limits. They are too valuable right now and their stock should continue to rise for at least the rest of the season. Looking at the White Sox roster, there are two things there that look like the Cardinals could offer that Williams might want: outfielders and power-relievers. I’d let Williams pick two of the three to go along with Reyes in a package.
Rick Ankiel – He shows a ton of power and the OBP in the outfield doesn’t seem to be a huge sticking point for Chicago (see Posednik, Erstad). The fact that he can play CF adds a lot of value as the White Sox have been trying several different players there without effect.
Joe Mather – This year’s Terry Evans got promoted before he got traded. I’m a Mather fan but not necessarily a believer. His stock’s high right now and I’m not sure he’s ever going to walk enough to stick as a MLB right-fielder. Jermaine Dye looks to be gone at the end of the year — could Mather be the White Sox’s everyday RF next year?
Chris Perez – I’ve said it often and I’ll say it again: his lack of command worries me. This is the type of high ceiling prospect you have to move to acquire a front of the rotation starter these days though. Other people would be more dismayed at Perez moving than I would.
Dennis Dove – He’s major league ready and he throws hard. That’s Kenny Williams M.O. for relievers right there.
Matthew Scherer/Kyle McClellan/Jason Motte – These AA players have the statistical results but not necessarily the stuff of Chris Perez. They’re lesser prospects on most rankings but still something that would be an interesting pickup in the back end of a deal.
I think the Cardinals could get this done by packaging Reyes, Ankiel/Mather and Perez. That seems like a trade that benefits both sides in the near and longer term. My question for you is whether that seems palatable to Cardinal Nation?
Filed under: Raiding the Farm
erik
azruavatar
fewgoodcards
roarke49
theredbaaron
if the cards aren’t going to let reyes work out his problems in stl, i say go for it. he has nothing left to prove at memphis, and we have a roster move looming w/the return of looper. sell super high on ankiel and see what williams says. it doesn’t hurt to ask…lol.
I think I’d rather give up a Reyes, Hamilton, reliever package. They may bite on Hamilton because Thome won’t be around that much longer. I wouldn’t be too thrilled about giving up Perez but if we had to trade him instead of Scherer/Motte/Dove/McClellan, I’d still probably do it. Actually, I’d rather give up Brad Thompson. With only one good pitch, Thompson strikes me as someone who isn’t going to have a long productive career. Batters will figure him out as they’ve done this year. Trade him now before his value drops lower. He may have close to the trade value that Perez has currently.
fpslackers - No AL team is going to want Thompson. Konerko has another 4 years left on his contract — Hamilton isn’t near enough to the majors since he just made AA.
If Mark Buehrle comes here, it’s a safe bet that we can sign him to an extension before he hits the market and gets blown away by offers from the Red Sox and Yankees. So even though it would be a rental, if we could pull the trigger with Reyes, Perez and Mather going to Chicago, I would do it.
This is one way I look at it: Buehrle is a durable lefty with worrying peripheral trends. Reyes is a top prospect in his mid-20’s with good stuff and lots of potential. [Insert valuable reliever] could help save a dying bullpen and stick around for a few years. So far, this deal is sounding A LOT like the Mulder deal, the only thing missing is the young hot-hitting catcher. Good thing we don’t have one of those for KW to demand. Oh, wait… Basically, I’m worried that we’ll lose Anderson in this deal. The Sox don’t have a future catcher beyond A.J. Pierzynski, and if we don’t put a top prospect in the mix, someone else will.
giving up Reyes for Buehrle makes sense, because Tony and Duncan
can’t get it done with Reyes.with home town discount Buehrle will get 4 yrs 54 mil min.
open mkt 5 yrs 90 mil.
We need all the young studs we can keep. the lack of talent at the major league is depressing. sal for 2008 albert,rolen,edmonds,carp,mulder,looper,Jaun E.,kennedy, is about
71 mil. leaves about 19 mil for the rest. izzy option add 8mil
that leaves 11 mil. how do we sign Buehrle.and 16 others.
Sure that’d be great, but considering that KW is asking for Kemp and maybe Billingsley/Broxton (if reports are to be believed), a trade can’t possibly get done with the troika off limits.
Seeing as the team isn’t going anywhere this year, the Cards have no business trading for Buehrle regardless of his interest in signing an extension. Better to save the prospects and go all in for Zambrano, Buehrle, or Jennings in the off season…
well, it’s official, reyes to memphis. what the frick??? just free the kid, no reason for him to rot in memphis…grrrrrr!!!
guayzimi - KW can ask for that all he wants. if no team bites and Buerhle won’t do an extension his demands will come down. That’s GM posturing — don’t buy into it.
This deal will not happen because Buerhle will not grant the kind of hometown discount stated above. Besides, that would put three soft-tossing lefties in the rotation by the end of the season. Is that what you really want?
This is all a waste of time because Mark Buerhle has said that he wants to stay in Chicago. There’s no way he’s lying, because athletes never do.
/sarcasm.
I think that’d be a fair package for Buerhle though
I would package Reyes, Encarnacion, And Mather. The white sox are looking to dump Dye and Konerko, Encarnacion, and Mather could be some replacements until they trade those two and get better prospects. You may have to offer one reliever to get the deal done. . . maybe a Cate or Dove. I leave Perez here to take over Izzy’s job in 09. That would leave an 08 rotation of carp, buerle, mulder, adam w, and either maroth/looper. Ankiel could take over right next year, and our farm is still looking ok.
The white sox would have zero interest in encarnacion — like pretty much every other team right now. The only teams that may be interested in encarnacion would be ones looking to bolster their bench at the deadline. He has almost zero trade value.
Just to let you know Erik or Azruavatar, Carlos Gomez has his opinion of Kyle Russell out now on THT. (although it’s not like he’s going to be playing for the Cards)
Just noticed he did Mortenson too, so I’ll be expecting a big post about the 2 tomorrow.
I’d expect KW to want Dove and Reyes. And I’d expect WJ to be willing to part with them. The other guy is probably Ankiel. Tony clearly has a thing for Ank, so I bet the Cards would hold on to him a bit more tightly. In the end, though, I think both sides would take MB for these three. If it’s Perez rather than Dove, same story. If the Cards could stick Mather in rather than Ank, that would be their preference.
LaDuncketty probably already foresee next year’s rotation as Carp, Muld, Wainwright, Bloop and Maroth. Reyes is expendable. If they can get MB and then re-sign him, they’d be willing to bump someone. Not for Reyes.
Now, on to my opinion…not a chance that I do this deal. Reyes’ ability to handle this morass with grace has told me all I need to know. He’s got to stay. Give him a spot in the rotation next year and live with it. Spend the $ on a bat. This win now stuff is Jocketty’s short-sightedness, or else just habitual.
Andrew - Ankiel is a 27 year old CF with no plate discipline. Despite the attachment that Cardinal Nation has to him, he should be traded if any GM wants him. The power he’s showing is nice but he’s nothing more than a 4th outfielder with pop right now given his complete lack of plate discipline. The clock is working against him. I’d rather hold onto Mather than Ankiel.
Reyes’ ability to handle this morass with grace has told me all I need to know. Buerhle is a legitimate front of the rotation starter in the AL with solid peripherals (after an abberation last year). Reyes has potential but Buerhle’s there. He’s only 3 years older than Reyes.
I’m not attached to Ankiel–I think Cardinal mgmt may be. If it comes down to Mather v. Ank I don’t think it is a deal breaker either way. I am glad to see Mather having a break out year and hope he can keep it up (run of mid to upper 700s in OPS in lower levels), and I’m encouraged that you like him going forward. (Or is that more a function of your low view of Ankiel?)
At any rate, my hang up with the deal revolves around Reyes and the long term. 1. We’re selling when his value is at its lowest. 2. Reyes is the type of player that a middle-to-largish market team has to develop to stay competitive. He’s going to be inexpensive for several years. Yeah, he won’t be Mark Buerhle during that time, but he’ll cost about $13M per year less, and that’s if we can re-sign Buerhle (rather likely but not a given if he’s traded over). Our big $$ ought to be going to bats in the trade/FA market. Even though hitters are overpaid as well, at least they are a more reliable commodity.
I would be more likely to pull the trigger if we had a window to negotiate an extension.